[Atgxtg]

Originally Posted by Nightshade

I have two responses to that:

1. We don't really know the likelyhood of that occuring in real life, because what damage points really mean in practice is vague.

2. My own opinion is that almost any game system simple to use is going to, in some circumstances, either understate or overstate damage.

1) Oh come on, by that reasoning we can't come to any sort of conclusions or, indeed, any use for damage points. What damage points really mean isn't vague. It is a measure of how much punishment something (or someone) can take before ceasing to function and or dying.

By your argument, how can we assign damage rating to weapons, or AP to armor? Really.

The whole point of 'damage" ratings is that they reflect a relative ability of weapons to inflict injury.

The problem with the impale rule is that it doubles not only the ability of a weapon to inflict a more serious injury, but to bypass defenses as well. In the real world, a certain thickness of materal will stop a bullet. WIth the impale rule, 1 in 5 hits will have about twice the penetrating power in terms of damage points.

In game terms that means that pistol fire can penetrate APCs, as the damage scale is compresssed enough that the doubling for impale is greater than the difference by round.

For instance, an implaling .45 round at 2d10+4,about the same as an elephant gun! (3D6+4).


What we do know in real life is that certain armors will protect against certain rounds (barring defects, hitting a uncovered area, and the other uncontrolled factors that help account for cortical hits). A .32 is not going to get through a Class II vest. Nor will emptying the clip into a foe wearing such a vest inflict enough blunt trauma to kill them. With the implae rules, you got a good chance of killing the guy.

That's why armor first makes sense.

2. Perhaps. But by how much? The 5th edition CoC firearm values are poor numbers. Chasoium has used different values in the past, and they did a better job.

Originally Posted by Nightshade

Well, that's an issue with those specific numbers, which I'll not defend, having not even seen them.

Well, you've been defending them so far. Those numbers are the cause of most of the problems too. They compress the damage scale greatly in favor of the .45ACP. Different damages and many of the problems go away.
Toss hit locations into the equation and many more problems disappear, too. With hit locations a single shot from any way has a chance to incapacitate a foe.

Originally Posted by Nightshade

You can do a limited form of it, making AP weapons higher base value but divided in half after armor, and things like fragmenting ammo the inverse.

Yup. Several RPGs do that. With BRP I thing a straight halving/doubling mechanic might be too severe (most games with halving/doubling don't have a fixed HP system). But something along those lines would help.

Originally Posted by Nightshade

The only exceptions might be things like fighter aircraft which are rather tight for space.

And, lots of fuel....

Originally Posted by Nightshade

That'd be my own preference; then you can assign them damage points per location and base effects on the proportion of that. It'd be a bit of generic work, but it ought to produce at least a tolerable result.

Probably mine too. Like I wrote earlier, CORPS has hit locations for vehicles and a damage system that can be equated toBRP fairly easily. Use Timelords/CORPS based damage rating would fix a lot of the CoC problems, too, or at least reduce them.