Cthulhu Rising as official Chaosium settings for BRP?

[Ottomancer]

Originally Posted by Trifletraxor

So you've considered a non-mythos Cthulhu Rising allready? How would the setting change if stripped of its Lovecraft influences & mythos element? Would it be something like the difference between RuneQuest 3rd edition & the Basic Roleplaying Monographs (essentially just name-changes), or would it alter the setting drastically? I quite like the setting as it is, and hope it would still have the same "feel" to it.

Cheers,
Sverre.

I guess the only way to find out if it would work would be for me (or someone else) to write something for Cthulhu Rising, but without an overtly mythos plotline.

There are quite a few people who think that Cthulhu Rising is purely military sci-fi. There are three campaigns available from the website. One is pure military, one is aimed at civilian investigators, and a third is aimed at investigators being police officers.

As far as I am aware, there two sci-fi monographs for Call of Cthulhu in print at the moment, and a third on the way very soon. You could argue that out of these three, the only one that overtly relies on the Cthulhu Mythos for its setting is Cthulhu Endtimes. Cthulhu Rising and from what I have read of Cthulhu Adventus could probably both work with the mythos elements removed. This isn't a criticism of either setting at all - it makes them both strong settings IMO in that the settings themselves are interesting enough to play in anyway.

[Steffworthington]

Cthulhu Rising and from what I have read of Cthulhu Adventus could probably both work with the mythos elements removed. This isn't a criticism of either setting at all - it makes them both strong settings IMO in that the settings themselves are interesting enough to play in anyway.

Thanks for that! It was the point I was trying to get across and you've just paid me a huge compliment!

I think CR is 'Us against the mythos' or with it removed, a pretty good sci-fi setting in the mould of 2300AD, 'Gurps Space', Uplift, etc

I think CA is 'Us against the mythos... and ourselves.' with a juxtaposition of 2 evils and a cloud of mistrust and despair. With the mythos I've imagined it as a kinda Delta Green/Stargate/1984/Equilibrium crossover. Without it it's strong suit (anti-fascism and betrayal of the ideals it sets for its populace) becomes a little stronger and more direct. I see it as more like the WEG game 'Price of freedom', Reichstar, or a serious and dark version of Paranoia.

[Ottomancer]

Originally Posted by Steffworthington

Thanks for that! It was the point I was trying to get across and you've just paid me a huge compliment!

I think CR is 'Us against the mythos' or with it removed, a pretty good sci-fi setting in the mould of 2300AD, 'Gurps Space', Uplift, etc

No worries. I wanted to have a play of CA at Furnace 2007 but didn't have time as I only found out about the event shortly beforehand and had stuff at home that I had to get back to Saturday afternoon.

[Joseph Paul]

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Well color me surprised! If it was actually for (the still dead) 2300AD and not T20 I might even give it a look.

Stefworthington wrote:

You're comment was regarding the setting, not the rules. The setting is still nearly identical.

My comment is in two parts: first surprise that it was being published and secondly the observation that for me personaly it isn’t worth it with T20 stats.
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Transhumanist ideals are not everything.

Stefworthington wrote:

i mentioned it because you implied we needed more and that there was a vaccum of such settings

I implied no such thing. I stated that with one setting effectively dead there should be no issues for a BRP product that was similar to it. I made no assertions about any abundance or dearth of hard SF settings.

.
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Interesting. It looks like Classic Traveller in that it wants to enable all manner of Sci-Fi tropes. I doubt its dedication to being Hard SF though.

Stefworthington wrote:

You've just contradicted yourself. Wants to 'enable all manner of sci-fi tropes'. How did you think that hard sci-fi might not be one of them?

‘Wants to’ is not the same thing as ‘succeeds at’. From what I can see of the rules it doesn’t support Hard SF all that well. I definitely get the feeling that it does not concern itself with the actual business of living and working in space. Further the rules are drawn from an iteration of the HERO system. They are much more concerned with game effects than actual science and engineering. Of course that impression comes from the lite version of the rules so I could be wrong which is why I stated that “I doubt its dedication” rather than flatly stating that it was not hard SF.
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This review completely pans High Frontiers. I don't get your point in adding it as if it is a bad hard SF game then there is room for a good hard SF game. Would that come with a cigarette to smoke after the session?

Stefworthington wrote:

I'm adding it as a 'hard sf' game. good or bad it illustrates my point that I laid out a couple of paragraphs above. I personally didint like transhuman space or high colonies and largely agree with the review. the point is, it's still an example of such a setting.

Well it would be germane if I had actually made any claim that there was a glut of Hard SF games which I did not. I figure it as a pretty weak argument against BRP doing a Hard SF setting. ‘Oh my! Some one else has already released a product that failed to meet the expectations of the Hard SF crowd. That means that we shouldn’t even try.’
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You mean the way that fantasy systems need a completely new Sword & Sorcery idea to be competitive? In actuality I do not see your point in condemning Hard SF as a background for a BRP Space setting. I certainly don't see that niche being exploited to the fullest it could be.

BTW RIngworld isn't going to happen. The license is locked up in the movie rights and that project isn't going anywhere.

Stefworthington wrote:

yes. they do. I wasn't condemning hard sf as a background (its the only SF I'll play) but if BRP is, as its guessed, to kick start Chaosiums rise back into fortune then I want them to get it right by having a setting that'll be unusual enough to last. Cthulhu is almost unique...thats why its lasted. If BRP was to have an SF setting then id prefer it to be hard sf. There are many examples of sf games that have bit the dust (cyberpunk).

Ringworld was a suggestion, not a call to arms. if I could wave a magic wand and have an unavailable lisence to use...it would be Blade Runner... or any of PKD's novels.

Well you have certainly come across as hostile and defeatist of BRP using a Hard SF setting since your earlier argument seems to be that since there already are Hard SF settings out there, some of which have failed, BRP needs to stay out of it and search for something ‘new’. As it is you have shown that Hard SF is a viable setting that people want to play. I would caution to beware of uniqueness. It cuts both ways; while it can be attractive it can also be a turn off for others by being too strange and new. Well written, detailed settings with strong story arcs are a better bet in my estimation.
My comment re Ringworld was a lament not a slam.

As a contributor to '2320AD' by QLI (I drew all the logos) I'd have to disagree.
http://www.travellerrpg.com/2320/
Also, there are a number of hard sci-fi games out there-
http://www.sjgames.com/transhuman/
http://www.lightspeed-rpg.com/
http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_119.html

What BRP needs is a completely NEW sci-fi idea (or as new as you can get). Either something really different by someone talented or a new licence.. or an old one (Ringworld 2 anyone?)

[Trifletraxor]

To me, what it boils down to is either:

1) License a sci-fi setting (cost money) and try to make some thing BRPish out of it, hoping it will be good,

2) Wait for someone to make something completely new and hope it will be good,

OR

3) Use a good existing BRP sci-fi setting that shows a lot of promise and which allready have a lot of support, and expand upon that one.

To me the choice seems really simple.

SGL.

[Enpeze]

How about Blue Planet? Quite hard SF but with interesting creative twists and profundly researched in its scientific background. As far as I know, its in the hands of Fantasy Flight Games at the moment. Its original rule system is not that bad and rather gritty. (but no BRP of course) So a conversion should be easy.

[Simlasa]

I'm strongly in favor of Chaosium not taking on any more licenses for a while... let Mongoose eat them all and pay through the nose, BRP needs some of it's own original content... I'm not sure if CR counts as that or not.

[Joseph Paul]

Maybe what we need is a consensus about what a 'strong' setting is?

For me a strong setting is one that is detailed, well thought out, internally consistent, and that offers opportunities for adventure of both the legal and illegal kind.

It has to have scope too. Being confined to just one system in a SF game isn't my bag of tea although the Jovian Chronicles made a good stab at it.

If it is a Hard SF game then I want the stars to be right and for the technology to be at least plausible.

Thoughts?

[Simlasa]

I don't think a 'strong' setting requires loads and loads of detail... more importantly it needs a distinct and obvious 'flavor' that pervades it... lots of obvious adventure hooks and things that grab the imagination.

I've read one page descriptions that did more for me than books with hundreds of pages...
Then again, what tickles one person's fancy might bore the tears out of another.

[Nightshade]

I think a bigger problem is that I haven't observed people have a lot of agreement on what translates as "hard" SF in the past.