Balance... whatever it is

[Nightshade]

Originally Posted by Rurik

I think RQ3 by the book has a more variation in starting character ability than any other game I ever played (excepting maybe Traveller), and it mostly depended on that 2d6 age roll.

The variance in profession using the randomizer there didn't help. While I realize some people's experiences differ, I didn't see a lot of people who enjoyed playing a civilized farmer in the group otherwise consisting of a civilized soldier, a barbarian warrior, a nomad noble and a primitive hunter (which was suprisingly good profession for typical adventuring because it got so many useful skills such as the stealth and perception ones).

[Gnarsh]

Also, remember that RQ3 professions were "parent occupation". In other words, that's the profession your were born into. There was no requirement to keep it, and in fact there were rules for changing profession if you wanted to. We typically allowed a new character to pick any of the more "standard" professions that might be available in the area if he wanted without penalty (obviously, you couldn't just choose to be a noble if you weren't born to it).

IMO, they added flavor to the game. It wasn't just "I'm carbon copy warrior number 19...". You were something else when you grew up, and then you (presumably) decided to go off in search of adventure, ran into a group of troublemakers (the rest of the player characters) and things just snowballed from there.

There were a couple very useful aspects to the profession lists as well. Firstly, it just gave you a general sense of what a given type of person might be able to do. If your characters for some reason need to organize a group of farmers to help defend their village from raiding barbarians, how skilled are they going to be? What skills might they have that could be useful? What magic? Can they sew? What about the local thieves guild? What kind of skills are they likely to have? How about a group of longshoremen? The professions gave the game environment a bit of consistency and foundation that many other games lack.

Additionally, it was a nice resource for player characters during offtime. If I don't play a character for a few years, what skills does he gain? Maybe I want to pay for training or something and roll a gazillion dice, but boy is it simpler to just find a profession that fits what he's doing when he's not adventuring and use that as a guideline (we allow some substitution of skills when doing this of course). Maybe my Earth cultist *is* a farmer when he's not adventuring?

[Nightshade]

Originally Posted by Gnarsh

Also, remember that RQ3 professions were "parent occupation". In other words, that's the profession your were born into. There was no requirement to keep it, and in fact there were rules for changing

There's nothing I'm finding that ever talks about changing it before the start of play, except for the general option to simply chose profession. I think you're perhaps confusing it with some other game.

[Atgxtg]

How do I delete this?

[Atgxtg]

Originally Posted by Nightshade

There's nothing I'm finding that ever talks about changing it before the start of play, except for the general option to simply chose profession. I think you're perhaps confusing it with some other game.

RQ3 Player's Handbook, above the Cilivilzed Occupation tables (page 28 in Book1 boxed edition, Page 30 in the paperback one book edition, but missing from the useless Games Workshop edition)

[Atgxtg]

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[Nightshade]

Originally Posted by Atgxtg

RQ3 Player's Handbook, above the Cilivilzed Occupation tables (page 28 in Book1 boxed edition, Page 30 in the paperback one book edition, but missing from the useless Games Workshop edition)

I knew about that, but since its in the same area (right below, in fact) chosing your age, its pretty much the same as just chosing occupation in the first place other than it allows you to mix and match.

[Kloster]

Originally Posted by Nightshade

I have to point out that if you chose age in addition to profession, the argument about replacement characters starts to become progressively moot; even a 27 year old RQ3 character (assuming you're still forcing them into the range that is potentially rollable) in one of the more adventuring professions is a relatively advanced character. With a decent attack modifier, for example, and using one's cultural weapons, the military professions could quite easily start at age 27 with their main weapons skills at 80% or higher; short of Gloranthan style runelords, that was already approaching as good as most RQ3 combatants were going to get barring a very long period of play.

So at some point if you are allowing too much manipulation here, the concept of "starting character" becomes essentially meaningless.

We kept age in the 'rollable' range. I should have said 'Choose one possible roll'

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[Kloster]

Originally Posted by Gnarsh

Also, remember that RQ3 professions were "parent occupation". In other words, that's the profession your were born into. There was no requirement to keep it, and in fact there were rules for changing profession if you wanted to. We typically allowed a new character to pick any of the more "standard" professions that might be available in the area if he wanted without penalty (obviously, you couldn't just choose to be a noble if you weren't born to it).

IMO, they added flavor to the game. It wasn't just "I'm carbon copy warrior number 19...". You were something else when you grew up, and then you (presumably) decided to go off in search of adventure, ran into a group of troublemakers (the rest of the player characters) and things just snowballed from there.

There were a couple very useful aspects to the profession lists as well. Firstly, it just gave you a general sense of what a given type of person might be able to do. If your characters for some reason need to organize a group of farmers to help defend their village from raiding barbarians, how skilled are they going to be? What skills might they have that could be useful? What magic? Can they sew? What about the local thieves guild? What kind of skills are they likely to have? How about a group of longshoremen? The professions gave the game environment a bit of consistency and foundation that many other games lack.

Additionally, it was a nice resource for player characters during offtime. If I don't play a character for a few years, what skills does he gain? Maybe I want to pay for training or something and roll a gazillion dice, but boy is it simpler to just find a profession that fits what he's doing when he's not adventuring and use that as a guideline (we allow some substitution of skills when doing this of course). Maybe my Earth cultist *is* a farmer when he's not adventuring?

The rules specifically states that you can change occupation during preliminary experience, if you fulfill the conditions. You have to stay at least 1 year and can't change your culture, but otherwise, you can switch to whatever you want, although you are of course right by saying GM discretion has to be applied for 'occupations' that can only be reached by heritage or by roleplay (like noble).
Same thing for the downtime.

Runequestement votre,

Kloster

[drohem]

Originally Posted by Gnarsh

Also, remember that RQ3 professions were "parent occupation". In other words, that's the profession your were born into. There was no requirement to keep it, and in fact there were rules for changing profession if you wanted to. We typically allowed a new character to pick any of the more "standard" professions that might be available in the area if he wanted without penalty (obviously, you couldn't just choose to be a noble if you weren't born to it).

IMO, they added flavor to the game. It wasn't just "I'm carbon copy warrior number 19...". You were something else when you grew up, and then you (presumably) decided to go off in search of adventure, ran into a group of troublemakers (the rest of the player characters) and things just snowballed from there.

Yes, I agree and how I viewed it as well. Once you became an adventurer, you stopped training in your parents occupation and persued your calling (whatever that may be).