Attribute Maxes in BRP0

[Tywyll]

Originally Posted by badcat

Tywyll, there is a culture in 3.5 that says the players should control the game more than the GM. Yes, really. So most everyone around here plays and has learned to play in that sort of culture, where the 'build' is more important than playing. So a lot of these new generation gamers expect to be able to use every trick and option in the rulebook. And D&D 3.5 is so inter related it is difficult to separate out parts of the rules...and that is how they expect any game to work. Ergo, a simple base game with house rules is an easier sell, if you want to try to introduce an older style of game, whether it be D&D or BRP. Or at least, that has been my experience lately. And 3.5 is not the only currently popular game with an emphasis on 'stuff' and 'kewl powerz' over actually playing a game. Look at Exalted.

OK, Jason, that makes sense. Now I just have to decide if it is $40 worth of useful to me. Thanks for the effort, though. I believe it will be far, far superior to the upcoming 4e no matter what.

I find that culture tends to be addressed when the GM is the only one with the rulebook. Selling a game, at least in my experience, hasn't been about passing it around and letting them read all the details... and usually a player doesn't like to buy a new book until they know they'll be playing the game for awhile.

I agree that there are many players who are all about the build, but that's not really unique to 3.5, that sort of min-maxing has always been around.

I've only encountered one player who felt that 'if its in a book, we should play it'. I just kept telling him 'no' until he got the hint.

[vagabond]

Originally Posted by badcat

I think that is the same thing.

Whether INT and POW are limited depend on which version of BRP you are playing. Early Stormbringer depended on higher and higher levels of INT and POW to become capable of summoning more powerful entities, for instance. It also was the source of some dissatisfaction with that game, because the wizards tended to have the best weapon skill bonuses too. INT and POW made you a better fighter as well as a better sorcerer...

Considering it was only 1% bonus per point over 12, and odds were any
INT and POW bonuses were offset by 1% penalties for low STR and DEX
(unless the characters were quite special - which fit well with the premise
of the saga/game), by the time you had sorcerers with high enough INT
and POW to make a difference, you most likely had warriors with very
high combat skills that made the stat bonuses fairly irrelevant.

-V

[vagabond]

Originally Posted by Jason Durall

It's a bit of a muddle, actually.

For Stormbringer 1st edition (my absolute favorite incarnation of the BRP system, bar none), it made sense that Elric was good in swordsmanship because of his incredible cunning and strength of will (his high INT and POW).

Having a system that supports the licensed intellectual property is a good thing.

However, Theleb K'aarna was absolutely no physical threat, but he had comparable bonuses due to the high INT and POW scores. The way the system worked, he should have been quite competent with any weapon he'd put his hand to. The same with Myshella, who was in no way a fighter.

From the SB3 book -

Elric has a +44% attack bonus (with drugs)
Myshella has a +34% attack bonus
Theleb K'aarna has a +27% attack bonus

In SB1-4, 90% total skill was considered "Master" level. Elric is significantly
more skilled than Theleb K'aarna, and much better than Myshella on that
scale by bonus. But then there is training. Elric as trained as one of if not
the best swordsman on Melnibone. Myshella was adept with the dagger in
the saga IIRC. Theleb K'aarna was not very adept with the sword.

Again, from the SB3 book -

Elric has a greatsword skill of 92% - Master level. Also, Sea Axe of 84%.
Myshella has a dagger skill of 100% (seems to fit, no other weapon training)
Theleb K'aarna has a shortsword attack of 44% (he only trained up 17%
over stat bonus - makes sense) and dagger of 89% (again, good, but not
master).

As I said earlier, the stat bonuses really do not make much of a difference
as you get more advanced characters hitting the 100% and over mark. It
was only those "special" characters that really benefitted.

-V