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Thread: SIZ (again!)

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    Default SIZ (again!)

    I know , I know. I keep coming back to this stat over and over again. But I've got to ask: if SIZ is a measure of weight ( as is stated inthe BRP SIZ table ) does that mean that in a zero G environment ie: weightless, everybody is SIZ 0 ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agentorange View Post
    I know , I know. I keep coming back to this stat over and over again. But I've got to ask: if SIZ is a measure of weight ( as is stated inthe BRP SIZ table ) does that mean that in a zero G environment ie: weightless, everybody is SIZ 0 ?
    I would say no, becouse an object in space can be "weightless", but it still has mass. After all, if an asteroid the size of Rhode Island strikes the earth, it doesnt budge it becouse both have mass, but the mass of the earth is much greater. Also, and I know this part is confusing for me as well, but SIZ is just as much a factor of height/length (in my opinion moreso) as weight.

    Just look at the SIZ table on page 26.

    A character that is 200 lbs can be SIZ 10 to 20.
    But a character that is 68" can only be SIZ 11-12.

    I agree though, that once you get above human size range, SIZ tends to be more a matter of weight than height.

    Rod
    Last edited by threedeesix; August 1st, 2009 at 14:44.
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    Quote Originally Posted by threedeesix View Post
    ...SIZ tends to be more a matter of weight than height.
    Given the starting comment that in space, everyone would have a SIZ of 0, for this discussion it's probably important to use Mass when we're talking about Mass and Weight when we're talking about Weight.

    I think the original BRP text was being colloquial in using Weight when in fact they meant Mass. Although I'm usually a stickler for precision, I think for the common reader, Mass and Weight mean the same thing. For those who know the difference, making a mental conversion from one to the other shouldn't be a problem.

    Steve
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    It's possible I might have been doing the mental equivalent of throwing a large stone into a pond and watching the splashes here

    Joking aside as I've said before SIZ is the one stat that really bugs me. Ideally I'd like to see three tables: weight, height, length with SIZ being an average of the three.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agentorange View Post
    Joking aside as I've said before SIZ is the one stat that really bugs me. Ideally I'd like to see three tables: weight, height, length with SIZ being an average of the three.
    I think they could just drop it all together, using 1/2 STR + 1/2 CON for hit points, STR only for damage modifier, and use STR, CON & DEX to evaluate how the character/creature deviates from the norm. >:->

    SGL.
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    SIZ for me has always been Mass, and I think ultimately for Chaosium too. Witness their ease of changing the characteristic for Ringworld, with the stipulation that actual weight would vary from world to world. I think they have always referenced it as weight because all their "worlds" were at 1G.

    I have always found the attempt at relation to height to be a bad idea. Too much variation, even among humans, to be meaningful.

    SDLeary

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    Chalk me up for 'Mass rather than weight' as well, although in certain circumstances treating SIZ as zero because you're in zero-G would make sense. It all gets a bit weird when you go off-world.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Byron Alexander View Post
    Chalk me up for 'Mass rather than weight' as well, although in certain circumstances treating SIZ as zero because you're in zero-G would make sense. It all gets a bit weird when you go off-world.
    I agree, I bet this is going to be answered within Interplanetary.
    Hint hint Jason. >:->

    Rod
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trifletraxor View Post
    I think they could just drop it all together, using 1/2 STR + 1/2 CON for hit points, STR only for damage modifier, and use STR, CON & DEX to evaluate how the character/creature deviates from the norm. >:->

    SGL.
    Ah, now you see I'd disagree with that. I think SIZ is a good stat to have, I just don't think it's done particularly well as it stands.

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    In physical science, Weight is measured in Newtons and represents the gravitational force between two objects of mass. It relates to Mass, measured in Grams/Kilograms (or whatever), in that the greater the mass of an object the greater the gravitational force towards an other object (eg a planet). Hence, a greater Mass usually indicates a greater Weight, depending upon the gravity involved. A 75kg mass has a weight of 750N (aprox) in Earth's gravitational field.

    To answer the question, then, Size represents a measurement of Mass combined with Height. It couldn't be a Weight characteristic, insofar that a person's Weight is dependent upon the gravitational pull of another object (or not, in the case of being in outer space). Weight can change depending upon the circumstances (eg 'weightlessness') but Mass is kept constant.

    My rule of thumb is that Size loosely represents the mass of the individual in Stones, although this is entirely unofficial.
    Last edited by TrippyHippy; August 2nd, 2009 at 03:56.

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